Wombles fred sponsored by January blues

[Roger_Sausage]

I've not read the thread yet so apologies if this has already been posted.

First time I’ve seen the incident and I was expecting something a bit more blatant given the comments. Interesting to see it from a different angle, but if it had been given against us I’d have thought it a soft penalty. DKD does go down easily.

It's a very flattering angle, from directly behind it was as blatant as blatant could be. Personally, I think he could've probably stayed on his feet and got the shot in, but it had to be a penalty. Especially taking into account what Bowery got sent off for.

[Scothie the Stag]

A view of what still angers me as an atrocious decision not to award us a late penalty yesterday from a former colleague and manager of mine, since retired, who also doubled up as a football referee assessor:

I have had a look, whereby for the sending off, the attacker was mid-way into the defensive half, on direct route to goal & much space beyond the defender so can see why he sent defender off.

As to the penalty, the Referee had much the same view as the tv camera by looking ‘towards’ the incident, whereby he would have been better placed getting more a side-on view. I think there was contact from the Home defender, though the probable reason why he didn’t give it, is that the Mansfield player went to ground a bit too easily, which always places doubt into the mind of a Referee. He may have also decided that the contact was minimal & therefore not sufficient. If there is any doubt, then a Referee is not likely to give a pen (though we all know some soft ones are given).

Did he not like you, or something?

Ignoring the fact that Davison might be offside, is your former colleague trying to say that Davison didn't go down easily? I'm struggling to see how it is a clear goal scoring opportunity, as the ball is bouncing far above head height, so Davison has to bring it under control and then get into a goalscoring position, all whilst Maris is moving far quicker than him. Even if Maris hadn't got to the ball, he was running down the centre of the pitch, so would have likely done enough to push Davison wide.

On the flip side DKD had the ball under control and is in a goalscoring position.

[bear 73]

2 thoughts from yesterday the players were brilliant gave 100% and the fans clapped and cheered it made you proud to be a stag.
All that happened yesterday is now past apart from a few fines coming in, oh and this sinking feeling in my stomach.
So nice for Swan to score he played well, and the bad news Flint injured a big-big loss.
Losing Bowery and Quinny we can cope within the squad, another day were the club shown passion and spirit.
Results went for us and we are still third with a game in hand over Crewe and Barrow.
We deserved a point but in football you dont always get what you deserve, when the dust settles we move on 18 games to go with a local derby next

[Rob]

The red card is debatable, the penalty isn't, the defender had both arms around DKD and pulled him down, it was probably a red card too as it prevented a clear goalscoring opportunity. On Bowery I think this would split refs but as one who always tried to keep 11 on I think given how far it was from goal I'd say it didn't meet the criteria of a clear goalscoring opportunity.

[Suttonian]

The red card is debatable, the penalty isn't, the defender had both arms around DKD and pulled him down, it was probably a red card too as it prevented a clear goalscoring opportunity. On Bowery I think this would split refs but as one who always tried to keep 11 on I think given how far it was from goal I'd say it didn't meet the criteria of a clear goalscoring opportunity.

Just out of interest, is there any guidance for referees on what to do if there are 2 balls on the pitch? During the move that led to Wimbledon's goal there was clearly a 2nd ball on the pitch as DKD chases down a back pass to the keeper. Looking at the ref's position it was in his line of sight as it rolls along the pitch on the left side of Wimbledon's penalty area

[Rob]

The red card is debatable, the penalty isn't, the defender had both arms around DKD and pulled him down, it was probably a red card too as it prevented a clear goalscoring opportunity. On Bowery I think this would split refs but as one who always tried to keep 11 on I think given how far it was from goal I'd say it didn't meet the criteria of a clear goalscoring opportunity.

Just out of interest, is there any guidance for referees on what to do if there are 2 balls on the pitch? During the move that led to Wimbledon's goal there was clearly a 2nd ball on the pitch as DKD chases down a back pass to the keeper. Looking at the ref's position it was in his line of sight as it rolls along the pitch on the left side of Wimbledon's penalty area

Well technically you are supposed to stop the game but of course if you did that every time it would encourage fans to throw balls onto the pitch every time the opposition went near your goal, so I think a level of common sense is allowed. I don't think the referee was wrong to ignore the ball on the pitch, only if play had gone on in the vicinity of the ball would he have blown up - usually at the next stoppage he will then ask for the ball to be removed.

[Suttonian]

Thanks for the answer Rob.

So it's another rule that gets ignored, just like the amount of time goalkeepers are allowed to hold the ball once they have it under control.

Supporters potentially throwing a ball onto the pitch is a hypothetical situation and shouldn't be a reason not to apply the laws of the game.

[georgefostersbeard]

When there was that horrendous offside decision against Port Vale, fans were calling for the assistant referee and the ref or be banned. In that case it was a horrendous mistake what annoys me more than that incident is, as you say, the times where refs constantly fail to apply the rules.
Clough said that Tuesday's 4th official told him that refs don't apply all of the rules

[Suttonian]

Yeah, that interview is what made me think of the rules that get ignored comment.

[Rob]

The problem is if you implement all the laws all the time you'd never get a game finished! For me the best referee's are the ones who do so with a light touch, firm when necessary but generally try to be in the background and keep the game moving - you can't do that if you strictly adhere to every law and I suspect if you ever saw a game where a referee did that you'd soon be changing your mind

I think the referee was right not to stop the game for the other ball on the pitch, event though technically he could have stopped the game. It was almost the only thing he did get "right".

[georgefostersbeard]

I actually agree, Rob, especially as the ball was thrown on by ours fans.
It is more the annual hard-line until October and then ignoring rules.
Things like keepers holding the ball for more than 6 seconds, subbed players not going off across the nearest touchline, stopping play for players to gett treatment when possession changes not upon the injury etc etc

[five to three]

Goalkeepers handling the ball outside the area every time they kick it out from their hands.

[lifestags]

We do need to look at our defending for the red card though, it was our free kick that we wasted, ball ended up back at Pym and flint stayed up, resulting kick from Pym ended up at their keeper, 1 long ball forward from him and Bowery is caught the wrong side.

[robeyre]

Since we are on refs and ref rules can anyone explain to a very old supporter what is supposed to be the function of the forth official. This is a genuine question. In my day the ref made all the decisions but the 2 linesman could draw his attention to infringements that he may have missed. Plus of course balls out of play and off sides.

[Upper West]

Goalkeepers handling the ball outside the area every time they kick it out from their hands.

People are always complaining about this.

If you look the keeper is throwing the ball up while still in the area and advancing outside the area to kick it.

It is something I look at and see no illegal kicks.

[victor A block]

No idea if a new striker is landing but even without, I think the performance gives Clough a selection issue.

Swan took his goal well and hopefully this could be the start of something.
DKD looked very lively up front and should have had the penalty. Should have taken the shot himself on his other big chance. Both injected pace which we have been lacking.
Would Clough every consider playing them as a front 2 especially at home where we look a bit negative.? It means dropping or moving Akins of course.

[HitchcocksShins]

Goalkeepers handling the ball outside the area every time they kick it out from their hands.

Except they're not, are they

[Amber Andy]

No idea if a new striker is landing but even without, I think the performance gives Clough a selection issue.

Swan took his goal well and hopefully this could be the start of something.
DKD looked very lively up front and should have had the penalty. Should have taken the shot himself on his other big chance. Both injected pace which we have been lacking.
Would Clough every consider playing them as a front 2 especially at home where we look a bit negative.? It means dropping or moving Akins of course.

I think Akins will be at right wing back on Saturday. Hopefully we will have a new striker by then.

[Sneag]

No idea if a new striker is landing but even without, I think the performance gives Clough a selection issue.

Swan took his goal well and hopefully this could be the start of something.
DKD looked very lively up front and should have had the penalty. Should have taken the shot himself on his other big chance. Both injected pace which we have been lacking.
Would Clough every consider playing them as a front 2 especially at home where we look a bit negative.? It means dropping or moving Akins of course.

I think Akins will be at right wing back on Saturday. Hopefully we will have a new striker by then.

Will JB get 1 game or 3 game ban?

[Amber Andy]

No idea if a new striker is landing but even without, I think the performance gives Clough a selection issue.

Swan took his goal well and hopefully this could be the start of something.
DKD looked very lively up front and should have had the penalty. Should have taken the shot himself on his other big chance. Both injected pace which we have been lacking.
Would Clough every consider playing them as a front 2 especially at home where we look a bit negative.? It means dropping or moving Akins of course.

I think Akins will be at right wing back on Saturday. Hopefully we will have a new striker by then.

Will JB get 1 game or 3 game ban?

Hopefully one.

[Sneag]

No idea if a new striker is landing but even without, I think the performance gives Clough a selection issue.

Swan took his goal well and hopefully this could be the start of something.
DKD looked very lively up front and should have had the penalty. Should have taken the shot himself on his other big chance. Both injected pace which we have been lacking.
Would Clough every consider playing them as a front 2 especially at home where we look a bit negative.? It means dropping or moving Akins of course.

I think Akins will be at right wing back on Saturday. Hopefully we will have a new striker by then.

Will JB get 1 game or 3 game ban?

Hopefully one.

Just looked it up & it should only be one, unless the ref decided it was violent conduct, which would surprise me, as he appeared to have been making the rules up as he went along.

[oldweststander]

No idea if a new striker is landing but even without, I think the performance gives Clough a selection issue.

Swan took his goal well and hopefully this could be the start of something.
DKD looked very lively up front and should have had the penalty. Should have taken the shot himself on his other big chance. Both injected pace which we have been lacking.
Would Clough every consider playing them as a front 2 especially at home where we look a bit negative.? It means dropping or moving Akins of course.

I think Akins will be at right wing back on Saturday. Hopefully we will have a new striker by then.

Will JB get 1 game or 3 game ban?

Hopefully one.

Just looked it up & it should only be one, unless the ref decided it was violent conduct, which would surprise me, as he appeared to have been making the rules up as he went along.

1 game for a professional foul, Quinn 1 game for two yellows unless the referee says different?

[Rob]

Since we are on refs and ref rules can anyone explain to a very old supporter what is supposed to be the function of the forth official. This is a genuine question. In my day the ref made all the decisions but the 2 linesman could draw his attention to infringements that he may have missed. Plus of course balls out of play and off sides.

I've done 4th official quite a few times and it really is a thankless task. Your main role (at an amateur level) is to control the two benches, administer substitutions, keep a full match record and as 4th you are the Reserve referee so you need to be ready to go on if the ref gets injured. At pro level the 4th is miked up so can offer support for on field decisions. In reality you just get moaned at by the benches and supporters for 2 hours, the easiest thing to do was just agree with them, it was pointless even trying to explain referee's decision as invariably the sidelines weren't really interested in explanations

[MOTG]

Since we are on refs and ref rules can anyone explain to a very old supporter what is supposed to be the function of the forth official. This is a genuine question. In my day the ref made all the decisions but the 2 linesman could draw his attention to infringements that he may have missed. Plus of course balls out of play and off sides.

I've done 4th official quite a few times and it really is a thankless task. Your main role (at an amateur level) is to control the two benches, administer substitutions, keep a full match record and as 4th you are the Reserve referee so you need to be ready to go on if the ref gets injured. At pro level the 4th is miked up so can offer support for on field decisions. In reality you just get moaned at by the benches and supporters for 2 hours, the easiest thing to do was just agree with them, it was pointless even trying to explain referee's decision as invariably the sidelines weren't really interested in explanations

Good update Rob. I cannot fully why Coaches and their back room staff have a right rant and rave at the 4th official as if they’ve made the decisions on the pitch .

[cassellswasmagic]

I suppose it’s the only person they can vent their frustration at during a game.