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Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Gazmoose82 » Thu Oct 07, 2021 12:42 am

NEStag wrote:
bear 73 wrote:A good read on Brewers talk, interviewing Ben Robinson he has been their chairman for 36 years and success for the football club has brought huge benefit to the town.

Ask him how Burton have managed to climb the football pyramid and his response is immediate, it was Nigel Clough.
It is true that not every football fan craves a careful owner, Supporters demand success and some times at any cost.
Since 1998 Burton have sacked 2 mangers.
.Peschisolido, March 2009, Buxton May 2020.
Still holding their own in league 1 with 3-200 gates.
Hoping with our fan base we can hold our own in the Championship


Bear, based on Mansfield Towns existence to date this is significantly detached from reality. We have spent ONE season in the championship getting on for 50 years ago. Morst of the time has been spent in League Two and quite a few more seasons in non-league.

I think most on here that have been fans for a while would settle for any form of sustainable League One status.

You mention the fan base but I'd say even if we were Championship level we'd still be significantly sub-10,000 attendances at that level.


Completely un-related to this thread..... But is it just me who feels robbed somewhat when the older generation stags fans talk about the heady days of when we were good?! :lol: the big games, amazing atmospheres & when football was proper etc etc.

I have to listen to my dad & his mates bang on about it every week... Im 30 years in and have mostly only seen div 4 boringness :cry:.

Anyway back on topic.... Seems the radfords have been strangely quiet on the predicament we find ourselves in....is Johnny preparing the dreaded vote of confidence for when we lose to oldham??
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Martin Shaw » Thu Oct 07, 2021 8:44 am

Gazmoose82 wrote:Seems the radfords have been strangely quiet on the predicament we find ourselves in....

John Radford has a page in the programme for each home league game. In Saturday's page, he talked about being pleased with the clean sheet at Orient, thanked Paul Nyland leaving after 10 years and gave him best wishes on his new job at Woodfordes' Brewery, and reminisced on rewarding Paul Cox with the car after we beat Barrow 8-1.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Thu Oct 07, 2021 9:32 am

Gazmoose82 wrote:
NEStag wrote:
bear 73 wrote:A good read on Brewers talk, interviewing Ben Robinson he has been their chairman for 36 years and success for the football club has brought huge benefit to the town.

Ask him how Burton have managed to climb the football pyramid and his response is immediate, it was Nigel Clough.
It is true that not every football fan craves a careful owner, Supporters demand success and some times at any cost.
Since 1998 Burton have sacked 2 mangers.
.Peschisolido, March 2009, Buxton May 2020.
Still holding their own in league 1 with 3-200 gates.
Hoping with our fan base we can hold our own in the Championship


Bear, based on Mansfield Towns existence to date this is significantly detached from reality. We have spent ONE season in the championship getting on for 50 years ago. Morst of the time has been spent in League Two and quite a few more seasons in non-league.

I think most on here that have been fans for a while would settle for any form of sustainable League One status.

You mention the fan base but I'd say even if we were Championship level we'd still be significantly sub-10,000 attendances at that level.


Completely un-related to this thread..... But is it just me who feels robbed somewhat when the older generation stags fans talk about the heady days of when we were good?! :lol: the big games, amazing atmospheres & when football was proper etc etc.

I have to listen to my dad & his mates bang on about it every week... Im 30 years in and have mostly only seen div 4 boringness :cry:.

Anyway back on topic.... Seems the radfords have been strangely quiet on the predicament we find ourselves in....is Johnny preparing the dreaded vote of confidence for when we lose to oldham??


I think that’s more to do with the availability of football now as opposed to how the Stags are doing.

We have been overdosed with big matches on the tv these days so they become common place. When I first started going you got part matches on the telly and the cup final. If you wanted anything else you had to go to your local team or travel miles to one of the larger cities. Crowds stood up and whole families went as ticket prices were well within the range of the average working man.

In respect of the vote of confidence, you’re having a laugh.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby MutinyOnTheCounty » Thu Oct 07, 2021 9:55 am

Incredibly tough stint right now, what with so many players injured/suspended.

But I'd ask the critics, what you'd expect a new gaffer to achieve under the same circumstances? Seems like we endure this perpetual 'worst ever' and 'anyone can do better' cycle every year or 2.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Gazmoose82 » Thu Oct 07, 2021 9:58 am

Martin Shaw wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:Seems the radfords have been strangely quiet on the predicament we find ourselves in....

John Radford has a page in the programme for each home league game. In Saturday's page, he talked about being pleased with the clean sheet at Orient, thanked Paul Nyland leaving after 10 years and gave him best wishes on his new job at Woodfordes' Brewery, and reminisced on rewarding Paul Cox with the car after we beat Barrow 8-1.


Yeah but there just generic program notes (probably written by his PA or summat) would like to know what he's REALLY thinking of nige's start to the season & how the players are letting him down.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby MTFCMusings » Thu Oct 07, 2021 10:01 am

Gazmoose82 wrote:
Martin Shaw wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:Seems the radfords have been strangely quiet on the predicament we find ourselves in....

John Radford has a page in the programme for each home league game. In Saturday's page, he talked about being pleased with the clean sheet at Orient, thanked Paul Nyland leaving after 10 years and gave him best wishes on his new job at Woodfordes' Brewery, and reminisced on rewarding Paul Cox with the car after we beat Barrow 8-1.


Yeah but there just generic program notes (probably written by his PA or summat) would like to know what he's REALLY thinking of nige's start to the season & how the players are letting him down.


What's to be gained from that? I doubt he's doing cartwheels.

I suspect he's as frustrated as the rest of us, and hoping that a manager with Clough's experience can turn it around.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Thu Oct 07, 2021 10:09 am

JR is an experienced businessman who has no doubt encountered difficulties on numerous occasions. He will look on this as difficulties which hopefully are temporary and ride out the storm.

There are plenty of reasons for our current situation and sacking the manager would only add to them.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Spiritater » Thu Oct 07, 2021 10:57 am

Martin Shaw wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:Seems the radfords have been strangely quiet on the predicament we find ourselves in....

John Radford has a page in the programme for each home league game. In Saturday's page, he talked about being pleased with the clean sheet at Orient, thanked Paul Nyland leaving after 10 years and gave him best wishes on his new job at Woodfordes' Brewery, and reminisced on rewarding Paul Cox with the car after we beat Barrow 8-1.

T'is almost like emigrating going to Norfolk for Big Paul. I assume he is leaving the area. I hope his new job isn't chief taster or all that work in the gym'll go to waste :lol:
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby bear 73 » Thu Oct 07, 2021 3:08 pm

Gazmoose82 wrote:
Martin Shaw wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:Seems the radfords have been strangely quiet on the predicament we find ourselves in....

John Radford has a page in the programme for each home league game. In Saturday's page, he talked about being pleased with the clean sheet at Orient, thanked Paul Nyland leaving after 10 years and gave him best wishes on his new job at Woodfordes' Brewery, and reminisced on rewarding Paul Cox with the car after we beat Barrow 8-1.


Yeah but there just generic program notes (probably written by his PA or summat) would like to know what he's REALLY thinking of nige's start to the season & how the players are letting him down.

So its John Radford now cannot be bothered to write or dictate the programme notes, and we find our selves in a predicament do we.
I take pride in having a new score board, and interested in thoughts that Bishop st stand could be standing only, and a increase in disabled parking.
The RH academy getting a lot of rave revues, coming out of the covid pandemic with no fans and looking forward to growth within the club.
Dead chuffed about bringing young players in and giving them game time, while training with the first team.
While we are struggling on the pitch with injuries and suspensions, proud of the support the fans are giving the players,
We have good owners, good C-E-O and a manager who cares about the club not his career,
their is to much to enjoy and it will take more than 1 summer for Mansfield to become force in league 2, But a couple of signings in Jan and who knows
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Hon Sec » Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:41 pm

Spiritater wrote:
Martin Shaw wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:Seems the radfords have been strangely quiet on the predicament we find ourselves in....

John Radford has a page in the programme for each home league game. In Saturday's page, he talked about being pleased with the clean sheet at Orient, thanked Paul Nyland leaving after 10 years and gave him best wishes on his new job at Woodfordes' Brewery, and reminisced on rewarding Paul Cox with the car after we beat Barrow 8-1.

T'is almost like emigrating going to Norfolk for Big Paul. I assume he is leaving the area. I hope his new job isn't chief taster or all that work in the gym'll go to waste :lol:

Never heard of working from home tater.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby HU7stag » Thu Oct 07, 2021 6:05 pm

bear 73 wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:
Martin Shaw wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:Seems the radfords have been strangely quiet on the predicament we find ourselves in....

John Radford has a page in the programme for each home league game. In Saturday's page, he talked about being pleased with the clean sheet at Orient, thanked Paul Nyland leaving after 10 years and gave him best wishes on his new job at Woodfordes' Brewery, and reminisced on rewarding Paul Cox with the car after we beat Barrow 8-1.


Yeah but there just generic program notes (probably written by his PA or summat) would like to know what he's REALLY thinking of nige's start to the season & how the players are letting him down.

So its John Radford now cannot be bothered to write or dictate the programme notes, and we find our selves in a predicament do we.
I take pride in having a new score board, and interested in thoughts that Bishop st stand could be standing only, and a increase in disabled parking.
The RH academy getting a lot of rave revues, coming out of the covid pandemic with no fans and looking forward to growth within the club.
Dead chuffed about bringing young players in and giving them game time, while training with the first team.
While we are struggling on the pitch with injuries and suspensions, proud of the support the fans are giving the players,
We have good owners, good C-E-O and a manager who cares about the club not his career,
their is to much to enjoy and it will take more than 1 summer for Mansfield to become force in league 2, But a couple of signings in Jan and who knows


Well said, Bear. Nice to see a bit of positivity on here for a change.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Gazmoose82 » Thu Oct 07, 2021 7:05 pm

HU7stag wrote:
bear 73 wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:
Martin Shaw wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:Seems the radfords have been strangely quiet on the predicament we find ourselves in....

John Radford has a page in the programme for each home league game. In Saturday's page, he talked about being pleased with the clean sheet at Orient, thanked Paul Nyland leaving after 10 years and gave him best wishes on his new job at Woodfordes' Brewery, and reminisced on rewarding Paul Cox with the car after we beat Barrow 8-1.


Yeah but there just generic program notes (probably written by his PA or summat) would like to know what he's REALLY thinking of nige's start to the season & how the players are letting him down.

So its John Radford now cannot be bothered to write or dictate the programme notes, and we find our selves in a predicament do we.
I take pride in having a new score board, and interested in thoughts that Bishop st stand could be standing only, and a increase in disabled parking.
The RH academy getting a lot of rave revues, coming out of the covid pandemic with no fans and looking forward to growth within the club.
Dead chuffed about bringing young players in and giving them game time, while training with the first team.
While we are struggling on the pitch with injuries and suspensions, proud of the support the fans are giving the players,
We have good owners, good C-E-O and a manager who cares about the club not his career,
their is to much to enjoy and it will take more than 1 summer for Mansfield to become force in league 2, But a couple of signings in Jan and who knows


Well said, Bear. Nice to see a bit of positivity on here for a change.


There really isn't... Its been dire apart from the last min peno against Bristol rovers which was a great moment (crowds back from covid etc).

As for the academy... Is it really doing that well? 98% of the players it produces end up playing on loan for woodhouse miners welfare in the end. Would much rather spend the cash on the first team.

Good CEO? What has he done exactly... Things have failed miserably under him & the club is going backwards.

Were light years away from being a 'force'
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby bobbystagsfan » Thu Oct 07, 2021 7:26 pm

There really isn't... Its been dire apart from the last min peno against Bristol rovers which was a great moment (crowds back from covid etc).

As for the academy... Is it really doing that well? 98% of the players it produces end up playing on loan for woodhouse miners welfare in the end. Would much rather spend the cash on the first team.

Good CEO? What has he done exactly... Things have failed miserably under him & the club is going backwards.

Were light years away from being a 'force
'


You'd be exactly the kind of person to moan about not having a youth team if we spent all of our money on the first team. A youth academy is always needed in football and whilst Mansfield don't produce world beaters we've seen the best youth crop we've got currently than in absolutely ages with some in and around the first team. We've obviously had to scale back the spending which we saw under Evans, Flitcroft and Dempster to some degree.

We're having a tough time as stags fans but doesn't it get tiring moaning all the time? I've been pissed off for weeks with Mansfield and I'm sure everyone else has but you just never bloody stop. Have a day off
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby chip63 » Thu Oct 07, 2021 7:36 pm

Nigel Clough joined us so he must be happy with Sharpe and the potential of the academy, he's already got more out of the academy then many previous managers.
With Sharpe we got Clough and survival from a possible relegation to that pit of misery that our neighbours are currently suffering every single day and the grass is definitely greener since he arrived in fact it's the best I've seen it.
2 or maybe 3 defenders away from something very special when you think that most of our best players will be here next year, think it's only Quinn who is on a year contract and that could be to do with age.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Gazmoose82 » Thu Oct 07, 2021 9:28 pm

bobbystagsfan wrote:
There really isn't... Its been dire apart from the last min peno against Bristol rovers which was a great moment (crowds back from covid etc).

As for the academy... Is it really doing that well? 98% of the players it produces end up playing on loan for woodhouse miners welfare in the end. Would much rather spend the cash on the first team.

Good CEO? What has he done exactly... Things have failed miserably under him & the club is going backwards.

Were light years away from being a 'force
'


You'd be exactly the kind of person to moan about not having a youth team if we spent all of our money on the first team. A youth academy is always needed in football and whilst Mansfield don't produce world beaters we've seen the best youth crop we've got currently than in absolutely ages with some in and around the first team. We've obviously had to scale back the spending which we saw under Evans, Flitcroft and Dempster to some degree.

We're having a tough time as stags fans but doesn't it get tiring moaning all the time? I've been pissed off for weeks with Mansfield and I'm sure everyone else has but you just never bloody stop. Have a day off


No i wouldnt.... Youth academies in lg2 football are next to useless.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby young vanish » Thu Oct 07, 2021 9:43 pm

bobbystagsfan wrote:
There really isn't... Its been dire apart from the last min peno against Bristol rovers which was a great moment (crowds back from covid etc).

As for the academy... Is it really doing that well? 98% of the players it produces end up playing on loan for woodhouse miners welfare in the end. Would much rather spend the cash on the first team.

Good CEO? What has he done exactly... Things have failed miserably under him & the club is going backwards.

Were light years away from being a 'force
'


You'd be exactly the kind of person to moan . . .


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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby bobbystagsfan » Thu Oct 07, 2021 10:17 pm

Gazmoose82 wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:
There really isn't... Its been dire apart from the last min peno against Bristol rovers which was a great moment (crowds back from covid etc).

As for the academy... Is it really doing that well? 98% of the players it produces end up playing on loan for woodhouse miners welfare in the end. Would much rather spend the cash on the first team.

Good CEO? What has he done exactly... Things have failed miserably under him & the club is going backwards.

Were light years away from being a 'force
'


You'd be exactly the kind of person to moan about not having a youth team if we spent all of our money on the first team. A youth academy is always needed in football and whilst Mansfield don't produce world beaters we've seen the best youth crop we've got currently than in absolutely ages with some in and around the first team. We've obviously had to scale back the spending which we saw under Evans, Flitcroft and Dempster to some degree.

We're having a tough time as stags fans but doesn't it get tiring moaning all the time? I've been pissed off for weeks with Mansfield and I'm sure everyone else has but you just never bloody stop. Have a day off


No i wouldnt.... Youth academies in lg2 football are next to useless.


I'm sure teams like Exeter and Crewe don't agree with you. Think we also produced a few players that went on to earn us promotion and have careers in the championship and prem too, but yeah next to useless like you say.

Probably a few more who have successful youth systems in the lower leagues too.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Gazmoose82 » Thu Oct 07, 2021 11:59 pm

bobbystagsfan wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:
There really isn't... Its been dire apart from the last min peno against Bristol rovers which was a great moment (crowds back from covid etc).

As for the academy... Is it really doing that well? 98% of the players it produces end up playing on loan for woodhouse miners welfare in the end. Would much rather spend the cash on the first team.

Good CEO? What has he done exactly... Things have failed miserably under him & the club is going backwards.

Were light years away from being a 'force
'


You'd be exactly the kind of person to moan about not having a youth team if we spent all of our money on the first team. A youth academy is always needed in football and whilst Mansfield don't produce world beaters we've seen the best youth crop we've got currently than in absolutely ages with some in and around the first team. We've obviously had to scale back the spending which we saw under Evans, Flitcroft and Dempster to some degree.

We're having a tough time as stags fans but doesn't it get tiring moaning all the time? I've been pissed off for weeks with Mansfield and I'm sure everyone else has but you just never bloody stop. Have a day off


No i wouldnt.... Youth academies in lg2 football are next to useless.


I'm sure teams like Exeter and Crewe don't agree with you. Think we also produced a few players that went on to earn us promotion and have careers in the championship and prem too, but yeah next to useless like you say.

Probably a few more who have successful youth systems in the lower leagues too.


Weve had one decent youth generation (the Lawrence, bappa, buxton, disley generation) in about 40 years.....only reason the current crop of youngsters are anywere near the 1st team is because we have no-one else... Otherwise they would be on loan at basford lets face it.

Sure there are one off exceptions like at exeter etc but im sure i read somewhere that only 0.05% of acadamy players ever play 1st team football... Thats a damming statistic.

The u23 league is a terrible std and pointless... We should follow the brentford model.

Would be interested to hear sedgewicks view on this... Im sure he has some kind of experience working with acadamys (i maybe wrong!)
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby bobbystagsfan » Fri Oct 08, 2021 5:26 am

Gazmoose82 wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:
There really isn't... Its been dire apart from the last min peno against Bristol rovers which was a great moment (crowds back from covid etc).

As for the academy... Is it really doing that well? 98% of the players it produces end up playing on loan for woodhouse miners welfare in the end. Would much rather spend the cash on the first team.

Good CEO? What has he done exactly... Things have failed miserably under him & the club is going backwards.

Were light years away from being a 'force
'


You'd be exactly the kind of person to moan about not having a youth team if we spent all of our money on the first team. A youth academy is always needed in football and whilst Mansfield don't produce world beaters we've seen the best youth crop we've got currently than in absolutely ages with some in and around the first team. We've obviously had to scale back the spending which we saw under Evans, Flitcroft and Dempster to some degree.

We're having a tough time as stags fans but doesn't it get tiring moaning all the time? I've been pissed off for weeks with Mansfield and I'm sure everyone else has but you just never bloody stop. Have a day off


No i wouldnt.... Youth academies in lg2 football are next to useless.


I'm sure teams like Exeter and Crewe don't agree with you. Think we also produced a few players that went on to earn us promotion and have careers in the championship and prem too, but yeah next to useless like you say.

Probably a few more who have successful youth systems in the lower leagues too.


Weve had one decent youth generation (the Lawrence, bappa, buxton, disley generation) in about 40 years.....only reason the current crop of youngsters are anywere near the 1st team is because we have no-one else... Otherwise they would be on loan at basford lets face it.

Sure there are one off exceptions like at exeter etc but im sure i read somewhere that only 0.05% of acadamy players ever play 1st team football... Thats a damming statistic.

The u23 league is a terrible std and pointless... We should follow the brentford model.

Would be interested to hear sedgewicks view on this... Im sure he has some kind of experience working with acadamys (i maybe wrong!)



Something that requires patience and a team to be built over a few seasons. Something most stags fans haven't got. I'm sure the anti stattos on here would love that as well :lol:
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Sedgwick » Fri Oct 08, 2021 8:00 am

Gazmoose82 wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:
Gazmoose82 wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:
There really isn't... Its been dire apart from the last min peno against Bristol rovers which was a great moment (crowds back from covid etc).

As for the academy... Is it really doing that well? 98% of the players it produces end up playing on loan for woodhouse miners welfare in the end. Would much rather spend the cash on the first team.

Good CEO? What has he done exactly... Things have failed miserably under him & the club is going backwards.

Were light years away from being a 'force
'


You'd be exactly the kind of person to moan about not having a youth team if we spent all of our money on the first team. A youth academy is always needed in football and whilst Mansfield don't produce world beaters we've seen the best youth crop we've got currently than in absolutely ages with some in and around the first team. We've obviously had to scale back the spending which we saw under Evans, Flitcroft and Dempster to some degree.

We're having a tough time as stags fans but doesn't it get tiring moaning all the time? I've been pissed off for weeks with Mansfield and I'm sure everyone else has but you just never bloody stop. Have a day off


No i wouldnt.... Youth academies in lg2 football are next to useless.


I'm sure teams like Exeter and Crewe don't agree with you. Think we also produced a few players that went on to earn us promotion and have careers in the championship and prem too, but yeah next to useless like you say.

Probably a few more who have successful youth systems in the lower leagues too.


Weve had one decent youth generation (the Lawrence, bappa, buxton, disley generation) in about 40 years.....only reason the current crop of youngsters are anywere near the 1st team is because we have no-one else... Otherwise they would be on loan at basford lets face it.

Sure there are one off exceptions like at exeter etc but im sure i read somewhere that only 0.05% of acadamy players ever play 1st team football... Thats a damming statistic.

The u23 league is a terrible std and pointless... We should follow the brentford model.

Would be interested to hear sedgewicks view on this... Im sure he has some kind of experience working with acadamys (i maybe wrong!)


Academies at this level are fine... if you're not spending a great deal on them. Pick up free players, pay them nothing, educate them, if they make it then brilliant, if they're in the first team on low wages, also good... its not all about selling them.

The problem is clubs spending loads and loads of money, then thinking one player sale of say £1 Million makes it worth it, when they've probably spent 5 times that since that player joined the academy. Most academies at the club don't hope the majority of players will make it... they have two or three per age group they think are good enough and the rest are there to make up the numbers for those highlighted others to play with so its an immediate waste of money.

Derby are a shining example, their academy is one of the best in the country. Great set up, great scouting system, great education and rate of going to play first team games is really good... however they've sold Jayden Bogle and Max Lowe recently and not scratched the surface of what its cost to develop them. They've got a number in the first team squad on low wages but aren't at the level required and they have chucked money at it, they were well clear of united Liverpool and city a few seasons ago.. think they won premier league two twice?! One they really thought would go on and be a first team regular and premier league hopeful played for Bristol Rovers against us this season...
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Fri Oct 08, 2021 8:06 am

I presume academies tap into government educational finance streaming for the educational part of the placements. That should considerably reduce the overall costs surely?.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby bear 73 » Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:53 am

The fact is we need young players coming through our academy and supporting our first team squad, money is tight at our level and quality is needed to progress and this costs money.
The Academy is a hard slog and the rewards are few and take time,
If managed well it can be a lifeline
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby arsene wengers coat » Fri Oct 08, 2021 1:17 pm

Urgh... The same tired old debate. Is a YT worth it? Blah blah blah... In theory yes, in practice probably not, because we don't seem to get the quality, even when we promoted the YT manager he binned the lot of them off.

The YT serves more than just ushering players through. It creates community, we make links with other local big clubs like Derby and Sheff U, a d allows us to take a chance on others cast Offs that aren't ready yet.

But let's be realistic. We can't attract or keep talent at that level, a higher Category YT from say Derby or Sheff U would take precedence. For David to beat Goliath, he needed to use a different weapon. If David and Goliath had used the same weapons, Goliath would have won.

What I'm saying is, we can't compete on a level playing field. We have to do something differently to all the rest. We can't outspend and we cant out perform the bigger club's, but we can outthink them. We just haven't yet.

If you are weak, and you fight someone harder than you are, on their terms, you will lose. To avoid losing, you would try to do something differently. Try a new approach, a new strategy.

I get that YTs are good because they do X,Y and Z, but in reality, we can't compete and so the question begs, why bother going into the fight if you're just going to lose to someone stronger and harder?

If we do uncover the next Mesi who lives down the road at Ravenshead, he can't sign pro terms until he's 17, so there is no way we can protect our investment. He will simply be taken from us.

The game is unfair and horrendously in favour of the bigger club's YT academies.

The alternative to this is a 'Mansfield B team'. we should have a first team squad of say 45. Cap the manager to 10 new established pro signings a year and fill the ranks full by signing as many local cast Offs from forest, Derby, Leicester and Sheff U etc. This allows us to have a first XI of experienced pros, and allows us to sift the local young talent without the need to nurture a squad at each age level, where we have no right to protect our interests. And we are also protected contractually if a young lad turns out to be one who slipped through the net. Would be a brave approach but we'd soon get some players who are nearer first team action than what we currently get.

If one season we struggled to score enough goals, we could buy a striker, and sign 8 strikers who are all 20yo. In a way it's succession planning too.

To be even more radical, why don't we start looking way further afield, eastern Europe, Africa? Where we aren't competing with the usual big hitters?

In simple economic terms this is known as buying when the stock is low.

People often trot out the Albert Einstein quote about doing something differently to get different results, well we as a club are testament to that. We do things the same as all the others but we can't compete, so we're always in L2.

The problem we have as a club is we can't compete fairly. So we need to do something differently. We never do. That applies to attracting young fans, ticket prices, recruitment etc. It's our main reason for persistent failure in my opinion.

Necessity breeds innovation comrades, if we aren't happy with our current lot, we should break the mould. Christ, even Notts County are trying something different.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby garlic » Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:56 pm

Interesting view Arsene Wengers Coat, didnt Watford implement your strategy a couple of years ago? I think they scrapped their academy and signed young players, 18+, who were discarded by premier league academy`s. As for signing youngsters from further afield the refugee camps in Greece are. apparently, being scouted by many European clubs, and some are not exactly treating the young lads as they should .Quite how a club like MTFC could establish a scouting network to cover such an area like E.Europe and Africa I do not know, but I`m sure there are scouting networks established, making sure they are ` decent ` networks is another matter.
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Re: Clough & Sharpe out.... Flynn & Carolyn in

Postby arsene wengers coat » Sat Oct 09, 2021 8:08 am

Hi garlic. It was a raspberry version of the Brentford model.

Regarding the human rights, I'm not suggesting that we send resources to these far flung places, but use existing networks and software to tap into these unearthed talents. Just bluesky thinking really.
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