{ the forum }
 
An independent supporters' website dedicated to Mansfield Town FC

Our Manager

Discuss all things Stags and Football League Two, and share stuff using our BBCodes.
Forum rules
Please read the Posting Rules before participating. Posting on the forums is subject to adhering to these.
Also, see the Guidelines for Posting. Moderators may sometimes tidy posts which do not follow these customs.

Re: Our Manager

Postby Billy the fish » Sat Sep 11, 2021 7:07 pm

cerfjaune wrote:
marksay wrote:I think that Sharpe needs to lay on his sword for the tripe that’s on the pitch defensively . Cloughie sounded dare I say it like Coughlin in post match . Asked what can you do , get better players . Okeefe and Mayounese are better but they are on loan . So why haven’t we got better CBS. You can’t put all the eggs in one basket ie Perch , you must have depth in squad. When NC was asked in August you happy with squad it was a yes good cover all over the pitch.

NOT THE CASE

How many times does it have to be said: Sharpe is not in charge of recruitment.


Is he not in charge of sanctioning and negotiating contracts ???
User avatar
Billy the fish
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 2737
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 2:54 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby Sedgwick » Sat Sep 11, 2021 7:12 pm

Billy the fish wrote:
cerfjaune wrote:
marksay wrote:I think that Sharpe needs to lay on his sword for the tripe that’s on the pitch defensively . Cloughie sounded dare I say it like Coughlin in post match . Asked what can you do , get better players . Okeefe and Mayounese are better but they are on loan . So why haven’t we got better CBS. You can’t put all the eggs in one basket ie Perch , you must have depth in squad. When NC was asked in August you happy with squad it was a yes good cover all over the pitch.

NOT THE CASE

How many times does it have to be said: Sharpe is not in charge of recruitment.


Is he not in charge of sanctioning and negotiating contracts ???


Got nothing to do with choosing targets though which is what a lot are blaming him for
Sedgwick
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 6699
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:01 pm
Location: Bristol

Re: Our Manager

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Sat Sep 11, 2021 7:17 pm

Sedgwick wrote:
Billy the fish wrote:
cerfjaune wrote:
marksay wrote:I think that Sharpe needs to lay on his sword for the tripe that’s on the pitch defensively . Cloughie sounded dare I say it like Coughlin in post match . Asked what can you do , get better players . Okeefe and Mayounese are better but they are on loan . So why haven’t we got better CBS. You can’t put all the eggs in one basket ie Perch , you must have depth in squad. When NC was asked in August you happy with squad it was a yes good cover all over the pitch.

NOT THE CASE

How many times does it have to be said: Sharpe is not in charge of recruitment.


Is he not in charge of sanctioning and negotiating contracts ???


Got nothing to do with choosing targets though which is what a lot are blaming him for


But if he won’t pay an identified target enough, whose fault is it if the target signs for someone else?.

There was a line from Clough in a recent video (the deadline day one I think) which made me consider things may not be fine and dandy and we’d lost players for financial reasons. It wasn’t a direct criticism more of a hint but did make me raise a brow.
Hello! Hello! We are the North Stand Boys.
Sandy Pate Best Stag
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 7133
Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:37 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby bigalstag1 » Sat Sep 11, 2021 8:19 pm

Other teams manage to do it on a tin of beans, so money is definitely not the problem.
bigalstag1
First Team
First Team
 
Posts: 736
Joined: Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:51 am

Re: Our Manager

Postby arsene wengers coat » Sat Sep 11, 2021 8:31 pm

bigalstag1 wrote:Other teams manage to do it on a tin of beans, so money is definitely not the problem.


Exactly. Harrogate are a runaway train. We're still in the station... Other clubs are much better at squeezing quality out of very small budgets.

Morecambe are league 1.
You've got to go there and come back, to know where you've been.
User avatar
arsene wengers coat
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 7847
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2016 12:03 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby Sedgwick » Sat Sep 11, 2021 8:42 pm

bigalstag1 wrote:Other teams manage to do it on a tin of beans, so money is definitely not the problem.


I think our tin of beans is from Lidl... I don't think we have the budget people believe we do. Club has lost an awful amount of money "going for it" with Evans and Flitcroft, Dempster was even backed with transfer fee high wage players, and we had a season with no fans. I seriously think we're cutting it fine.

and I think Nigel Cloughs appointment fits into that. Hes always done well with little to no money available to spend, but has always had time and multiple windows.

Hewitt will be on low wages, Free transfer
Stirk wont be much, YT player, on loan
Burke next to nothing, just above a YT player, Free transfer
Bishop, covered by United so im told.
Nartey, partly covered by Burnley
Shelvey, first year pro level wages, again partly covered by forest?
Forrester, not currently paying him anything

Quinn, Average to good possibly same as what Burton had him on? Free Transfer
Danny Johnson, possibly higher but won't be a ridiculous amount otherwise Clough would have said no, Free Transfer.
Hawkins, similar to above. Free Transfer
Rhys Oates, turned down high wages to play league football, previously a conference player, cant see him being on crazy money, Free Transfer

Sinclair
Cooper
Law
Hill
Caine
Clarke
Ward
Scott... all on low wages. No idea how true, but first year pros apparently on £400 a week

Interested to see peoples thoughts and correct me if we did pay a fee for anyone.
Sedgwick
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 6699
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:01 pm
Location: Bristol

Re: Our Manager

Postby Sedgwick » Sat Sep 11, 2021 8:42 pm

arsene wengers coat wrote:
bigalstag1 wrote:Other teams manage to do it on a tin of beans, so money is definitely not the problem.


Exactly. Harrogate are a runaway train. We're still in the station... Other clubs are much better at squeezing quality out of very small budgets.

Morecambe are league 1.


Both have one thing in common, A manager or squad that's been built over many seasons.
Sedgwick
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 6699
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:01 pm
Location: Bristol

Re: Our Manager

Postby tillydog123 » Sun Sep 12, 2021 2:39 pm

Another couple of defeats and I can see Clough coming under pressure
He is an icon on football and have the greatest respect for him but saying his players not doing their job is not helpful or encouraging to players or supporters
HE signed most of them is the irony of it all
Win badly needed
JR is results man and nobody even Clough is bigger than MTFC
tillydog123
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 3834
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:28 am

Re: Our Manager

Postby Sedgwick » Sun Sep 12, 2021 2:50 pm

tillydog123 wrote:Another couple of defeats and I can see Clough coming under pressure
He is an icon on football and have the greatest respect for him but saying his players not doing their job is not helpful or encouraging to players or supporters
HE signed most of them is the irony of it all
Win badly needed
JR is results man and nobody even Clough is bigger than MTFC


You do realise him signing them doesn't automatically mean they will be world beaters? I don't understand the constant use of "BUT HE SIGNED THEM"... They were not his first choice and its not rocket science to know that a player you sign can turn out to be a disaster...
Sedgwick
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 6699
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:01 pm
Location: Bristol

Re: Our Manager

Postby Johnny H » Sun Sep 12, 2021 6:16 pm

Sedgwick wrote:
tillydog123 wrote:Another couple of defeats and I can see Clough coming under pressure
He is an icon on football and have the greatest respect for him but saying his players not doing their job is not helpful or encouraging to players or supporters
HE signed most of them is the irony of it all
Win badly needed
JR is results man and nobody even Clough is bigger than MTFC


You do realise him signing them doesn't automatically mean they will be world beaters? I don't understand the constant use of "BUT HE SIGNED THEM"... They were not his first choice and its not rocket science to know that a player you sign can turn out to be a disaster...


Who was NC's first choice centre half ?
Wasn't he the central midfield captain of the second biggest team in league one ?

That's where another issue lies with NC and his transfer business and team selections.......square pegs in round holes !!!

I think Rollin Menayese only played one game for NC, away at Carlisle I think....he was superb all game and dropped the next match (I may be wrong in that though....Tin Hat on ready :lol: :lol: )
Johnny H
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 1611
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2009 4:30 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby MTFCMusings » Sun Sep 12, 2021 6:18 pm

One league game yes, it was at Cambridge.
MTFCMusings
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 13581
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 10:16 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby one f in mansfield » Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:32 am

if we had anything like a decent start to the season this board would be heaving about the sacking of Hughton at Forest
Don,t believe everything you read on the internet --William Gladstone 1872
User avatar
one f in mansfield
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 2080
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2009 12:51 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby Sneag » Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:02 pm

MTFCMusings wrote:One league game yes, it was at Cambridge.


Probably his best game for us too. He was excellent after picking up an early booking.

I was surprised he was dropped for the next game.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.
User avatar
Sneag
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 13956
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 6:41 pm
Location: King Solomon he never lived `round here

Re: Our Manager

Postby garlic » Thu Sep 16, 2021 6:15 pm

Sneag wrote:
MTFCMusings wrote:One league game yes, it was at Cambridge.


Probably his best game for us too. He was excellent after picking up an early booking.

I was surprised he was dropped for the next game.

I think everybody was surprised he wasnt given another opportunity to prove himself, but what does that say about Nigel, is he as obstinate as he appears to be? Does he take ` dislikes ` to players despite their footballing qualities? ( O`Keefe could come into this category ) , and why is he so unprofessional when he slags players off in public? I really did expect young Mr. Clough to have more about him that he has shown to date.
garlic
First Team
First Team
 
Posts: 940
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 7:40 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby chip63 » Thu Sep 16, 2021 7:52 pm

Sneag wrote:
MTFCMusings wrote:One league game yes, it was at Cambridge.


Probably his best game for us too. He was excellent after picking up an early booking.

I was surprised he was dropped for the next game.


He was probably late for training all that week and was rightfully dropped.
chip63
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 3043
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2009 12:01 am

Re: Our Manager

Postby Amber Andy » Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:05 pm

Sedgwick wrote:
arsene wengers coat wrote:
bigalstag1 wrote:Other teams manage to do it on a tin of beans, so money is definitely not the problem.


Exactly. Harrogate are a runaway train. We're still in the station... Other clubs are much better at squeezing quality out of very small budgets.

Morecambe are league 1.


Both have one thing in common, A manager or squad that's been built over many seasons.

Exactly. You can add Accrington Stanley to the list as well.

We will do the same. We need to be patient. It took the great Ian Greaves time and he got his man ( Foster ) to build the team around. Sadly we were millimetres away with Naylor, who I feel NIgel Clough would have built the team around.
Amber Andy
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 9998
Joined: Wed Aug 26, 2015 7:38 am

Re: Our Manager

Postby arsene wengers coat » Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:39 pm

Reading some management research, and saw something that I've paraphrased that I think might apply to us.

When an employee fails or performs poorly, managers typically do not blame themselves. Whatever the reason, the problem is assumed to be the employee’s fault and responsibility.

The 'set-up-to-fail syndrome' is where employees perceived to be mediocre or weak performers live down to the low expectations their managers have for them.

Unfortunately because of low expectations, they come to doubt their own thinking and ability, and they lose the motivation to make autonomous decisions or to take any action at all. The boss, they figure, will just question everything they do anyway.

Ironically, the boss sees the subordinate’s withdrawal as proof that the subordinate is indeed a poor performer. So what does the boss do? He increases his pressure and scrutiny of the employee, making the employee feel distrusted and so A vicious cycle starts.

From the outside looking in, Clough might be guilty of this across our team at the moment.
You've got to go there and come back, to know where you've been.
User avatar
arsene wengers coat
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 7847
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2016 12:03 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby garlic » Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:25 pm

arsene wengers coat wrote:Reading some management research, and saw something that I've paraphrased that I think might apply to us.

When an employee fails or performs poorly, managers typically do not blame themselves. Whatever the reason, the problem is assumed to be the employee’s fault and responsibility.

The 'set-up-to-fail syndrome' is where employees perceived to be mediocre or weak performers live down to the low expectations their managers have for them.

Unfortunately because of low expectations, they come to doubt their own thinking and ability, and they lose the motivation to make autonomous decisions or to take any action at all. The boss, they figure, will just question everything they do anyway.

Ironically, the boss sees the subordinate’s withdrawal as proof that the subordinate is indeed a poor performer. So what does the boss do? He increases his pressure and scrutiny of the employee, making the employee feel distrusted and so A vicious cycle starts.

From the outside looking in, Clough might be guilty of this across our team at the moment.

Couldn`t agree more, the only phrase I would disagree with is ` might be guilt`,as he most certainly is, and getting those defenders to now play at an acceptable level is going to be very hard.
garlic
First Team
First Team
 
Posts: 940
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 7:40 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby oldweststander » Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:32 pm

garlic wrote:
arsene wengers coat wrote:Reading some management research, and saw something that I've paraphrased that I think might apply to us.

When an employee fails or performs poorly, managers typically do not blame themselves. Whatever the reason, the problem is assumed to be the employee’s fault and responsibility.

The 'set-up-to-fail syndrome' is where employees perceived to be mediocre or weak performers live down to the low expectations their managers have for them.

Unfortunately because of low expectations, they come to doubt their own thinking and ability, and they lose the motivation to make autonomous decisions or to take any action at all. The boss, they figure, will just question everything they do anyway.

Ironically, the boss sees the subordinate’s withdrawal as proof that the subordinate is indeed a poor performer. So what does the boss do? He increases his pressure and scrutiny of the employee, making the employee feel distrusted and so A vicious cycle starts.

From the outside looking in, Clough might be guilty of this across our team at the moment.

Couldn`t agree more, the only phrase I would disagree with is ` might be guilt`,as he most certainly is, and getting those defenders to now play at an acceptable level is going to be very hard.



Time for the players to step up to the plate, no James Perch to rescue an appalling situation now. These guys are paid a great deal more money than most of those who pay to watch them underperform.

Cometh the hour, cometh the men.
oldweststander
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 5372
Joined: Sun Aug 25, 2013 11:17 am

Re: Our Manager

Postby garlic » Fri Sep 17, 2021 7:29 pm

Easier said than done Oldwestander, when you have been publicly slagged off and told you are not up to standard and better players are needed, you dont suddenly sit up and think oh well I am good enough after all. Clough has put the boot into his centre backs and now must massage their ego`s, sorry i dont think that is going to work, but I could be wrong and hope I am, because we dont want to go down the Coughlan road again.
garlic
First Team
First Team
 
Posts: 940
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 7:40 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby Sedgwick » Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:43 pm

garlic wrote:Easier said than done Oldwestander, when you have been publicly slagged off and told you are not up to standard and better players are needed, you dont suddenly sit up and think oh well I am good enough after all. Clough has put the boot into his centre backs and now must massage their ego`s, sorry i dont think that is going to work, but I could be wrong and hope I am, because we dont want to go down the Coughlan road again.


Pros really aren't that sensitive. Of they hear their gaffer slag them off, and mildly at that, in the media most will think sodd that and prove them wrong. Hewitt has admitted himself to Nigel he wasn't good enough and needs to do better.

Much better than when a player is raspberry and thinks they did well. Hewitt will improve.
Sedgwick
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 6699
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:01 pm
Location: Bristol

Re: Our Manager

Postby yorkshire stag » Sat Sep 18, 2021 5:57 am

been thinking about our situation, i’ve come to the conclusion in Nigel Clough we have some would say the most high profile experienced manager we’ve ever had, therefore we should sit back & trust his judgement & stewardship a bit more than normal as he will come good.

So i’m going to try, let’s see what today brings & what he will do about our defensive situation

over to you Gaffa
Our time will come
User avatar
yorkshire stag
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 14617
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2009 7:35 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby diablo » Sat Sep 18, 2021 7:07 am

yorkshire stag wrote:been thinking about our situation, i’ve come to the conclusion in Nigel Clough we have some would say the most high profile experienced manager we’ve ever had, therefore we should sit back & trust his judgement & stewardship a bit more than normal as he will come good.

So i’m going to try, let’s see what today brings & what he will do about our defensive situation

over to you Gaffa



I wouldn't say he was the most high profile Manager or most experienced in my time supporting Stags (since 1968 ) but he certainly raised expectations more than most Managers we have had . As frequently seen it is very easy to come a cropper ,just hope he can turn things around so we can enjoy a half decent Season , at the moment I would settle for a comfortable mid table position
diablo
First Team
First Team
 
Posts: 701
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2009 10:18 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby yorkshire stag » Sat Sep 18, 2021 9:47 am

diablo wrote:
yorkshire stag wrote:been thinking about our situation, i’ve come to the conclusion in Nigel Clough we have some would say the most high profile experienced manager we’ve ever had, therefore we should sit back & trust his judgement & stewardship a bit more than normal as he will come good.

So i’m going to try, let’s see what today brings & what he will do about our defensive situation

over to you Gaffa



I wouldn't say he was the most high profile Manager or most experienced in my time supporting Stags (since 1968 ) but he certainly raised expectations more than most Managers we have had . As frequently seen it is very easy to come a cropper ,just hope he can turn things around so we can enjoy a half decent Season , at the moment I would settle for a comfortable mid table position


same time as me then, so who you saying more high profile Ian Greaves ?
Our time will come
User avatar
yorkshire stag
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 14617
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2009 7:35 pm

Re: Our Manager

Postby one f in mansfield » Sat Sep 18, 2021 9:51 am

yorkshire stag wrote:
diablo wrote:
yorkshire stag wrote:been thinking about our situation, i’ve come to the conclusion in Nigel Clough we have some would say the most high profile experienced manager we’ve ever had, therefore we should sit back & trust his judgement & stewardship a bit more than normal as he will come good.

So i’m going to try, let’s see what today brings & what he will do about our defensive situation

over to you Gaffa



I wouldn't say he was the most high profile Manager or most experienced in my time supporting Stags (since 1968 ) but he certainly raised expectations more than most Managers we have had . As frequently seen it is very easy to come a cropper ,just hope he can turn things around so we can enjoy a half decent Season , at the moment I would settle for a comfortable mid table position


same time as me then, so who you saying more high profile Ian Greaves ?


Billy Bingham ?
Don,t believe everything you read on the internet --William Gladstone 1872
User avatar
one f in mansfield
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 2080
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2009 12:51 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Stagsnet Main Discussion Forum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: bobbystagsfan, iansmith, Son Of Sherwood, ST4GS and 118 guests