{ the forum }
 
An independent supporters' website dedicated to Mansfield Town FC

Stags and politics article

Discuss all things Stags and Football League Two, and share stuff using our BBCodes.
Forum rules
Please read the Posting Rules before participating. Posting on the forums is subject to adhering to these.
Also, see the Guidelines for Posting. Moderators may sometimes tidy posts which do not follow these customs.

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby Sneag » Fri Jan 18, 2019 5:42 pm

Woodclanger 1 wrote:
Never easy wrote:Not all Notts miners scabbed let me just add !


If you read this board it seems none did, strange really?


Not strange at all if you think about it.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.
User avatar
Sneag
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 13957
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 6:41 pm
Location: King Solomon he never lived `round here

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby ParisStag » Fri Jan 18, 2019 6:17 pm

It could be moved if people like, but the reason I posted it here is because of the links or lack of to the club and fans. I think that's a way more interesting topic anyway than why people voted Leave.
How significant is the role of the club in the community?
How does it fit in with local politics?
How do these questions relate to the history of the town?

If we're talking about those things I see no reason why it should be heated or moved to the other board.
User avatar
ParisStag
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:13 pm
Location: Nottingham

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby Mr Grimsdale » Fri Jan 18, 2019 7:13 pm

Field Mill wrote:You could of course argue that the Town has form in siding with the far right. After all, they sided with lady Thatcher over the pit strike. That said, I don't think there's anything right wing about wanting to be out of Europe. Mansfield, like many post industrial places voted leave to lash out at the political elites and their thirty years of 'centre ground' policies which translates as rapacious free market capitalism and the subsequent destruction of the UK manufacturing base.



Form in siding with the far right? I'm not sure about that. If you ask most Notts miners of which I was one, at the time whether they wanted to 'get in bed with Thatcher' they'd laugh at you. The mood of the time round here and right up to the borders with Yorkshire was one of not being bullied by an opportunistic chancer like Scargill, a man ideologically in direct polarity to Thatcher, both equally determined to win their own agendas, but which were the same, ultimate power.

As a result both sides were failed miserably whichever side of the divide they were on, certainly though, no one I knew at that time believed the creature in No10 would do us any favours.
One thing I don't hear every week is the chant of Scab 'resounding' around the ground but hey he wanted to emphasise an air of malevolence. Interesting comparison with Stoke on Trent though, in 84 that area widely worked throughout.
Mr Grimsdale
Subs Bench
Subs Bench
 
Posts: 647
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:56 pm

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby Mr Grimsdale » Fri Jan 18, 2019 7:19 pm

Marky Mark wrote:I was the person quoted in the article who worked with Tony Evans to give him a little insight - I thought it was going to be a bit more of a 'why have people in Mansfield voted Brexit' type article than one that links working class football fans and politics, and saw my chance to put a few records straight, but I don't think it affected the end result.

What I was attempting to get across was that Mansfield in the last 40 years had a very big role in the country's prosperity, we powered the country through coal, our hosiery industry clothed the women and when you went out night the pint you drank had our name on it. Why wouldn't you be proud to say that you were from Mansfield? We were even partly responsible for the dance music boom in the 90s with Renaissance being conceived in Mansfield.

Over the last 40 years this has gradually eroded; the pits closed (they were always going to), the intertwined engineering business closed, the hosiery factories closed (they were always going to) and the brewery closed - not only did the brewery close but the charred remains of the body is still there as a warning. The manufacturing spine went out of the area and with it went a large part of our reason to be proud of the area and our identity, and that is why the football club is increasingly more important to the identity of the area - at least we have that, and our league status, and a ground that isn't out of town and plastic. After an era when you could point to why we were different the industry was razed to the ground and we were spat out into an increasingly globalised world with no discernible features remaining, and nothing to set us and our inhabitants apart from other similar sized identikit provincial towns with exactly the same ring-roads, out of town retail parks and education and training - you're exactly the same as Chesterfield, as Stoke, as Wakefield, as Doncaster. Competing with Shrewsbury for a call-centre on the graves of our old pits. The only thing that has changed is that they've made the roads wider so that people can get out quicker. No-one ever asked anyone from Mansfield whether they wanted to compete with Shrewsbury for a call centre - they just took our industry and expected us to do it.

Our area had mass local immigration before immigration was trendy, miners coming from all over the country to help mine coal - Ollerton is testament to that, in the 60s and 70s loads of miners from the North East and Scotland coming down to work there and then staying and their kids had kids. There were loads of Polish working there in the 80s too. Immigration is welcomed in times of prosperity, in times when there's enough work to share around, Mansfield welcomes you to share our prosperity - I voted Remain but was saying that Mansfield is no more anti-outsiders than anywhere else, so don't come trying to make out that the leave vote was all because of outsiders. The town voted Leave because successions of governments have steam rollered over us despite how we've voted, took our vote for granted and changed absolutely nothing for us, the economy was already knackered for us before the credit crunch came along, and austerity made it worse - all of that just gave it the sense of having something to blame it on. When actually we would always have been ignored.


Well put Mark.
Mr Grimsdale
Subs Bench
Subs Bench
 
Posts: 647
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:56 pm

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby Sedgwick » Fri Jan 18, 2019 7:52 pm

I think most people have found it a great read... My friends at Mundial Mag and copa90 now have a soft spot for Mansfield and want us to do well this year. The part about all the industry closing down has made my Sunderland supporting mate follow us as his second team. Very much a similar story for many working class places...

Stags really is the focal point to Mansfield.. its a drab place now that offers very little but when I return home Its always centred around watching the mighty MTFC. I grew up during the decline, I can remember pits closing and the brewery going, and my first memories of us are being promoted then nothing but misery via a painful play off final. Yet Ive been incredibly lucky to work in football and visit many grounds, Ive never felt an atmosphere like Mansfield, where you can say anything and find someone to talk to with something very much in common. Theres a sense of togetherness and its coming back big time. Stags on the up, and hopefully just like Sunderland when the club does well the town will too.
Sedgwick
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 6699
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:01 pm
Location: Bristol

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby Parkinsons Perm » Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:03 pm

Sneag wrote:
Woodclanger 1 wrote:
Never easy wrote:Not all Notts miners scabbed let me just add !


If you read this board it seems none did, strange really?


Not strange at all if you think about it.


I have thought and still find it strange.
Parkinsons Perm
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 7841
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2009 9:46 pm

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby julianshatnasty » Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:22 pm

It's like the last thirty years never happened. Strange how most political debates on here can't get past events that happened thirty years ago.

No wonder that the vote is taken for granted and the political class have taken the pi ss out of the town for so long. Why should they think any different if the people can't move on themselves.

I was born in the seventies, thirty years after WW2 and just at the point that people harking back to winning the war were being derided for living in the past. The miners strike was in the 80s so let's all move on and stop making it an excuse for everything, no one under the age of 40 gives a toss, we all have other reasons for voting the way we do rather than an issue nearly two generations ago.
julianshatnasty
Reserve Team
Reserve Team
 
Posts: 250
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2017 12:23 pm

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby Mr Grimsdale » Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:35 pm

Woodclanger 1 wrote:
Sneag wrote:
Woodclanger 1 wrote:
Never easy wrote:Not all Notts miners scabbed let me just add !


If you read this board it seems none did, strange really?


Not strange at all if you think about it.


I have thought and still find it strange.



I worked, and would again if the circumstances arose like they did at that time. What I won't do is criticise those that believed in what they did for striking. It's 30 plus years ago, I've never thought I was in the wrong and I can cite many of my own reasons for the decision I made, as can those that went on strike.
I think I understand what your statement is alluding to Sneag so I felt I must put what I have. You and I have discussed this before, so I know where you are coming from.
For all the shambolic, self interested , undemocratic lying bunch we currently have in power..........the alternative which is rearing its head in JC for me is worse.
Apologies to those who will say move this thread etc........I could agree on one hand and on the other I would say that MTFC and the miners strike are intrinsically linked, and always will be hence it always comes up on here.
Mr Grimsdale
Subs Bench
Subs Bench
 
Posts: 647
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:56 pm

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby Dave Wayne » Sun Jan 20, 2019 11:20 pm

Field Mill wrote:voted leave to lash out at the political elites

And instead sided with Nigel Farage, Boris Johnson and Jacob Rees-Mogg !! :lol:
Dave Wayne
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 2283
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 8:13 pm

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby MutinyOnTheCounty » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:05 pm

Field Mill wrote:You could of course argue that the Town has form in siding with the far right. After all, they sided with lady Thatcher over the pit strike. That said, I don't think there's anything right wing about wanting to be out of Europe. Mansfield, like many post industrial places voted leave to lash out at the political elites and their thirty years of 'centre ground' policies which translates as rapacious free market capitalism and the subsequent destruction of the UK manufacturing base.



Not sure that's true bud - as i recall the NUM wanted the strike put the vote, which is hardly the work of far-right militia or fascist? As mentioned, plenty has happened since the 80's strike - but, a bit like the local economy, everything seems stuck back in that decade


On a side note, i wonder what the bloke's 2 dogs are called?
Mauler and B****ck-Chomper spring to mind!! :P
If i look in pain it's because i'm thinking
User avatar
MutinyOnTheCounty
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 3038
Joined: Wed Sep 02, 2009 2:33 pm

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby bellwhiff » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:14 pm

Field Mill wrote:You could of course argue that the Town has form in siding with the far right. After all, they sided with lady Thatcher over the pit strike. That said, I don't think there's anything right wing about wanting to be out of Europe. Mansfield, like many post industrial places voted leave to lash out at the political elites and their thirty years of 'centre ground' policies which translates as rapacious free market capitalism and the subsequent destruction of the UK manufacturing base.

Far Right ? And Thatcher was Far Right ? Are you mental ?
Every man thinks meanly of himself for not having been a soldier...

Samuel Johnson
User avatar
bellwhiff
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 19498
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2009 7:14 pm

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby tillydog123 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 2:55 pm

Good article and again good to see the town and the club getting publicity and ta for posting it!
tillydog123
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 3834
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:28 am

Re: Stags and politics article

Postby Random Hero » Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:49 pm

Two fantastic reads there, thanks for posting.

I'll try not to be drawn too far into the political debate, there's plenty of other posters on here who will do that and probably make their points much more succinctly than me. :)

I just want to say a couple of things though.

Firstly, Mansfield seems to be getting more and more publicity recently, mostly good publicity at that. It's great to feel 'noticed' once more... this is a proud town, and it deserves its place on the map.

Secondly, I moved to the area when very young, but remember what life was like before I moved to Mansfield and the people who resided where I used to live. I can honestly say, hand on heart, that the people of this town are some of the most genuine, kindest, hard working people in the entire country, and deserve far better than they've been served up over the last 30 years.

I genuinely feel as though a turning point has been reached... not just at MTFC, but in the town in general - there's a more positive vibe to the place each time I visit. It's great to see.

Whenever anyone asks me where I am from, I am always proud to say I am from Mansfield - even if I have to explain where it is!... I firmly believe the future is bright. The path may not be clear right now and it definitely won't be an easy trip, but it's what I believe.
An der Elbe, werden Träume wahr
User avatar
Random Hero
Manager
Manager
 
Posts: 2719
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2009 6:35 pm
Location: Volksparkstadion

Previous

Return to Stagsnet Main Discussion Forum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: spizz fan and 86 guests